Apocryphal Academy

Автор Тема: ФРАНК СТОУНЕР: Митът за извънземните, Ню Ейдж наратив  (Прочетена 2699 пъти)

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Glasberg

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Ти не питаш за да знаеш.Ти пишеш просто за да...Пишеш..
Въобще не те интересуват отговорите,тях четеш диагонално и си изсмукваш някакви неща,вадиш думите от контекста им и ги изопачаваш ...

Напротив, уверявам те, че питам, за да знам.

Не съм приела коментара с личните преживявания сериозно. Затова питам отново.

А сериозно не съм го приела, защото не вярвам, че си външен наблюдател на Вселената.

Ти откъде знаеш, че онова, което си видяла, е Мултивселена?

Glasberg

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Аз не разбирам добре идеята за паралелни светове...По-лесно би ми било да мисля,че в Библията просто се говори за галактиките в нашата Вселената,това би било чудесно обяснение.Но нещо в мен се противи на това..
Възприемам идеята за съседни вселени,но паралелни?!?Мътна река...

Аз говоря за онова, което науката разбира под Мултивселена.

Ти, вероятно, говориш за нещо друго. Но аз не разбирам, за какво точно ... Та затова питах отново.

Паралелна реалност ... какво е?



В Мултивселената, вселените са отделни материални вселени. Това важи и за разклоненията на вселената в теорията на квантовата механика. Това са съвсем отделни, независими една от друга материални вселени.

« Последна редакция: Април 06, 2020, 11:27:22 am от Glasberg »

Glasberg

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Извинете, че се намесвам в спора ви, но в това изказване се съдържа някаква истина.

.... проявлението на Бог не се изчерпва само с едно творение?

В Библията се говори предимно за свят (ед.ч.), целия свят (ед.ч.). Едва в Евреи 1:2 и Евреи 11:3 се споменават "светове" (мн.ч.).
"в края на тия дни говори нам чрез Сина, Когото постави наследник на всичко, чрез Когото и направи световете"
"С вяра разбираме, че световете са били създадени с Божието слово, тъй щото видимото не стана от видими неща."


Благодаря ти, че се намеси в т.нар. спор.

Относно световете в Библията ... зависи, на кой точно превод се позоваме.



Евреи 1:2, Цариградски превод

Цитат
2 в тези последните дни говори нам чрез Сина, когото постави наследник на всичко, чрез когото и света направи;


Евреи 11:3, Цариградски превод

Цитат
3 С вера разумеваме че светът бе създаден със словото Божие, щото от неявляеми станаха видимите.





New International Version

Цитат
but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom also he made the universe.


New Living Translation

Цитат
And now in these final days, he has spoken to us through his Son. God promised everything to the Son as an inheritance, and through the Son he created the universe.


English Standard Version
Цитат
but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed the heir of all things, through whom also he created the world.


Berean Study Bible

Цитат
But in these last days He has spoken to us by His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, and through whom He made the universe.


Berean Literal Bible

Цитат
in these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, and through whom He made the ages,


New American Standard Bible

Цитат
in these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world.


New King James Version

Цитат
has in these last days spoken to us by His Son, whom He has appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the worlds;


King James Bible

Цитат
Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;


Christian Standard Bible

Цитат
In these last days, he has spoken to us by his Son. God has appointed him heir of all things and made the universe through him.


Contemporary English Version

Цитат
But now at last, God sent his Son to bring his message to us. God created the universe by his Son, and everything will someday belong to the Son.


Good News Translation

Цитат
but in these last days he has spoken to us through his Son. He is the one through whom God created the universe, the one whom God has chosen to possess all things at the end.


Holman Christian Standard Bible

Цитат
In these last days, He has spoken to us by His Son. God has appointed Him heir of all things and made the universe through Him.


International Standard Version

Цитат
has in these last days spoken to us by a Son whom he appointed to be the heir of everything and through whom he also made the universe.


NET Bible

Цитат
in these last days he has spoken to us in a son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom he created the world.


New Heart English Bible

Цитат
in these last days has spoken to us by a Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, through whom also he made the ages.


Aramaic Bible in Plain English

Цитат
And in these last days he has spoken with us by his Son, whom he ordained The Heir of all things, and by him he made the universe.


GOD'S WORD® Translation

Цитат
In these last days he has spoken to us through his Son. God made his Son responsible for everything. His Son is the one through whom God made the universe.


New American Standard 1977

Цитат
in these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world.


King James 2000 Bible

Цитат
Has in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he has appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;


American King James Version

Цитат
Has in these last days spoken to us by his Son, whom he has appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;


American Standard Version

Цитат
hath at the end of these days spoken unto us in his'son, whom he appointed heir of all things, through whom also he made the worlds;


Douay-Rheims Bible

Цитат
In these days hath spoken to us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the world.


Darby Bible Translation

Цитат
at the end of these days has spoken to us in [the person of the] Son, whom he has established heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;


English Revised Version

Цитат
hath at the end of these days spoken unto us in his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, through whom also he made the worlds;


Webster's Bible Translation

Цитат
Hath in these last days spoken to us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;


Weymouth New Testament

Цитат
has at the end of these days spoken to us through a Son, who is the pre-destined Lord of the universe, and through whom He made the Ages.


World English Bible

Цитат
has at the end of these days spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, through whom also he made the worlds.

Young's Literal Translation

Цитат
in these last days did speak to us in a Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He did make the ages;
« Последна редакция: Април 06, 2020, 03:32:35 am от Glasberg »

Glasberg

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New International Version

Цитат
By faith we understand that the universe was formed at God's command, so that what is seen was not made out of what was visible.


New Living Translation

Цитат
By faith we understand that the entire universe was formed at God’s command, that what we now see did not come from anything that can be seen.


English Standard Version

Цитат
By faith we understand that the universe was created by the word of God, so that what is seen was not made out of things that are visible.


Berean Study Bible

Цитат
By faith we understand that the universe was formed at God’s command, so that what is seen was not made out of what was visible.


Berean Literal Bible

Цитат
By faith we understand the universe to have been formed by the word of God, so that the things being seen have not been made from the things being visible.


New American Standard Bible

Цитат
By faith we understand that the worlds were prepared by the word of God, so that what is seen was not made out of things which are visible.


New King James Version

Цитат
By faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that the things which are seen were not made of things which are visible.


King James Bible

Цитат
Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.


Christian Standard Bible

Цитат
By faith we understand that the universe was created by the word of God, so that what is seen was made from things that are not visible.


Contemporary English Version

Цитат
Because of our faith, we know that the world was made at God's command. We also know that what can be seen was made out of what cannot be seen.


Good News Translation

Цитат
It is by faith that we understand that the universe was created by God's word, so that what can be seen was made out of what cannot be seen.


Holman Christian Standard Bible

Цитат
By faith we understand that the universe was created by God's command, so that what is seen has been made from things that are not visible.


International Standard Version

Цитат
By faith we understand that time was created by the word of God, so that what is seen was made from things that are invisible.

NET Bible

Цитат
By faith we understand that the worlds were set in order at God's command, so that the visible has its origin in the invisible.


New Heart English Bible

Цитат
By faith, we understand that the ages were prepared by the word of God, so that what is seen has not been made out of things which are visible.


Aramaic Bible in Plain English

Цитат
For by faith we understand that the worlds were fashioned by the word of God, and these things that are seen came into being out of those things which are unseen.


GOD'S WORD® Translation

Цитат
Faith convinces us that God created the world through his word. This means what can be seen was made by something that could not be seen.

New American Standard 1977

Цитат
By faith we understand that the worlds were prepared by the word of God, so that what is seen was not made out of things which are visible.


King James 2000 Bible

Цитат
Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.


American King James Version

Цитат
Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.


American Standard Version

Цитат
By faith we understand that the worlds have been framed by the word of God, so that what is seen hath not been made out of things which appear.


Douay-Rheims Bible

Цитат
By faith we understand that the world was framed by the word of God; that from invisible things visible things might be made.


Darby Bible Translation

Цитат
By faith we apprehend that the worlds were framed by [the] word of God, so that that which is seen should not take its origin from things which appear.


English Revised Version

Цитат
By faith we understand that the worlds have been framed by the word of God, so that what is seen hath not been made out of things which do appear.


Webster's Bible Translation

Цитат
Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which appeared.


Weymouth New Testament

Цитат
Through faith we understand that the worlds came into being, and still exist, at the command of God, so that what is seen does not owe its existence to that which is visible.

World English Bible

Цитат
By faith, we understand that the universe has been framed by the word of God, so that what is seen has not been made out of things which are visible.

Young's Literal Translation

Цитат
by faith we understand the ages to have been prepared by a saying of God, in regard to the things seen not having come out of things appearing;
« Последна редакция: Април 06, 2020, 03:16:26 am от Glasberg »

Glasberg

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Strong'sGreekEnglishMorphology
1909 [e]ἐπ’
ep’
inPrep
2078 [e]ἐσχάτου
eschatou
lastAdj-GNS
3588 [e]τῶν
tōn
-Art-GFP
2250 [e]ἡμερῶν
hēmerōn
daysN-GFP
3778 [e]τούτων
toutōn
theseDPro-GFP
2980 [e]ἐλάλησεν
elalēsen
has spokenV-AIA-3S
1473 [e]ἡμῖν
hēmin
to usPPro-D1P
1722 [e]ἐν
en
inPrep
5207 [e]Υἱῷ,
Huiō
[His] Son,N-DMS
3739 [e]ὃν
hon
whomRelPro-AMS
5087 [e]ἔθηκεν
ethēken
He appointedV-AIA-3S
2818 [e]κληρονόμον
klēronomon
heirN-AMS
3956 [e]πάντων,
pantōn
of all things,Adj-GNP
1223 [e]δι’
di’
throughPrep
3739 [e]οὗ
hou
whomRelPro-GMS
2532 [e]καὶ
kai
alsoConj
4160 [e]ἐποίησεν
epoiēsen
He madeV-AIA-3S
3588 [e]τοὺς
tous
theArt-AMP
165 [e]αἰῶνας·
aiōnas
ages,N-AMP
« Последна редакция: Април 06, 2020, 04:16:40 am от Glasberg »

Glasberg

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Strong'sGreekEnglishMorphology
4102 [e]Πίστει
Pistei
By faithN-DFS
3539 [e]νοοῦμεν
nooumen
we understandV-PIA-1P
2675 [e]κατηρτίσθαι
katērtisthai
to have been formedV-RNM/P
3588 [e]τοὺς
tous
theArt-AMP
165 [e]αἰῶνας
aiōnas
universeN-AMP
4487 [e]ῥήματι
rhēmati
by [the] wordN-DNS
2316 [e]Θεοῦ,
Theou
of God,N-GMS
1519 [e]εἰς
eis
so thatPrep
3588 [e]τὸ
to
whichArt-ANS
3361 [e]μὴ
notAdv
1537 [e]ἐκ
ek
from [things]Prep
5316 [e]φαινομένων
phainomenōn
being visible,V-PPM/P-GNP
3588 [e]τὸ
to
the thingsArt-ANS
991 [e]βλεπόμενον
blepomenon
being seenV-PPM/P-ANS
1096 [e]γεγονέναι.
gegonenai
have been made.V-RNA
« Последна редакция: Април 06, 2020, 04:16:53 am от Glasberg »

Glasberg

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aión: a space of time, an age
Original Word: αἰών, ῶνος, ὁ
Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: aión
Phonetic Spelling: (ahee-ohn')
Definition: a space of time, an age
Usage: an age, a cycle (of time), especially of the present age as contrasted with the future age, and of one of a series of ages stretching to infinity




Същата дума:


Матей 6:13

Цитат
13 и не ни въвеждай в изкушение, но избави ни от лукавия, [защото царството е Твое, и силата и славата, до вековете. Амин.
Цитат
13 и не въведи нас в изкушение, но избави нас от лукаваго; защото е твое царството и силата и славата во веки. Амин.


Матей 12:32

Цитат
32 И ако някой каже дума против Човешкия син, ще му се прости; но ако някой каже дума против Светия Дух, няма да му се прости, нито в тоя свят, нито в бъдещия.
Цитат
32 И който рече реч против Сина человеческаго, ще му се прости, но който рече против Духа Святаго, нема да му се прости нито в този век, нито в бъдещия.


Матей 13:22

Цитат
22 А посеяното между тръните е оня, който чува словото; но светските грижи и примамката на богатството заглушават словото, и той става безплоден.
Цитат
22 А в трънете посеяното, той е, който слуша словото, и грижите на този век, и измамата на богатството заглушава словото, и безплодно бива.


Марк 4:19

Цитат
19 а светските грижи, примамката на богатството, и пожеланията за други работи, като влязат, заглушават словото, и то става безплодно.
Цитат
19 и грижите на този век, и прелестта на богатството, и пожеланията за други работи, като навлезват, заглушават словото, и безплодно бива.


Марк 10:30

Цитат
30 и да не получи стократно сега, в настоящето време, къщи и братя, и сестри, и майки, и чада, и ниви, заедно с гонения, а в идещия свят вечен живот.
Цитат
30 и да не вземе стократно сега на това време къщи и братя и сестри и майки и чеда и нивя наедно с гонения, и в идущия век живот вечен.


Марк 11:14

Цитат
14 И Той проговори, думайки й: Отсега нататък никой да не яде плод от тебе до века. И учениците Му чуха това
Цитат
14 И отговори Исус и рече й: Никой вече до века да не яде плод от тебе. И слушаха това учениците му.


Лука 1:33

Цитат
33 Ще царува над Якововия дом до века; и царството Му не ще има край.
Цитат
33 И ще царува над дома Яков във веки, и царството му не ще да има край.

« Последна редакция: Април 11, 2020, 10:59:07 am от Glasberg »

Glasberg

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Евреи 1:1-2 на гръцки (Textus Receptus):

Цитат
1Πολυμερῶς καὶ πολυτρόπως πάλαι ὁ θεὸς λαλήσας τοῖς πατράσιν ἐν τοῖς προφήταις 2ἐπ' ἐσχάτων τῶν ἡμερῶν τούτων ἐλάλησεν ἡμῖν ἐν υἱῷ ὃν ἔθηκεν κληρονόμον πάντων δι' οὗ καὶ τοὺς αἰῶνας· ἐποίησεν


Евреи 1:1-2 на български:

Цитат
1 Бог Който при разни частични съобщения, и по много начини, е говорил в старо време на бащите ни чрез пророците,
2 в края на тия дни говори нам чрез Сина, Когото постави наследник на всичко, чрез Когото и направи «αἰῶνας»,
Цитат
1 Бог, който много пъти и с много начини говори в старо време на нашите отци чрез пророците,
2 в тези последните дни говори нам чрез Сина, когото постави наследник на всичко, чрез когото и «αἰῶνας» направи;



Казва се, че Бог е направил «αἰῶνας» чрез Сина.

Гръцката дума «αἰῶνας» е множествено число, винителен падеж на съществителното «αἰών».

«αἰῶνας» се превежда в Библията на български като:

  • “векове” (YLT)
  • “вселена” (NAB; NIV; NLT)
  • “свят” (ESV; NASB1; NET2; RSV)
  • “светове” (ASV; KJV; NKJV)


αἰῶνας, ед.ч. αἰών (aiōn). Обичайното значение на думата на гръцки е "продължителност/период от време".
« Последна редакция: Април 06, 2020, 10:11:12 am от Glasberg »

Glasberg

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На Иврит

About 380+ times in the Septuagint (pre-Christian Greek translation of the Hebrew scriptures), some form of αἰών translates עוֹלָם (ʿôlām), a very natural translation since they can both mean something like "eternity" ("a very, very, etc., long time").


This is almost exclusively the meaning that ʿôlām bears in the Hebrew Bible. However, by the time of the Midrashic literature, in rabbinic usage ʿôlām had taken on the sense of "existence, world" (from Marcus Jastrow's A Dictionary of the Targumim, etc., see the entry occupying most of the left column). Although it could still bear the sense of "eternity", this newer sense of "world" or "universe" became a very common usage.


Here's one example, chosen almost at random out of thousands. Solomon Schechter draws attention to the titles for God in relation to the world,1 noting among others: "the only [unique] one of the world". This is found in Bereshit/Genesis Rabbah 21, 5 which in Hebrew reads: יחידו של עולם (yechido shal 'olam),2 where ʿôlām is translated "world". (This is also very common in Jewish prayers, so not at all unusual.)




Back to Hebrews 1:2

The question about how to translate and understand αἰῶνας in Hebrews 1:2, then, turns on resolving this alternative: [a] is the word being used in its more typical sense of "eternity, long time", etc., OR, is the (anonymous) author aware of and using the meaning of "world" familiar to us from later rabbinic writings, Jewish liturgy, etc., which would be emerging around the time of the composition of Hebrews (so not an anachronism!)?3 We need to factor in, too, the fact that the Greek form in Heb 1:2 is a plural form: does the translation need to reflect this plurality? or is it a stereotyped expression/idiom, in which the plural doesn't really bear semantic value?
That's a fair few questions hiding under the surface, then.
« Последна редакция: Април 06, 2020, 10:46:33 am от Glasberg »

Glasberg

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The word aeon /ˈiːɒn/, also spelled eon (in American English), originally meant "life", "vital force" or "being", "generation" or "a period of time", though it tended to be translated as "age" in the sense of "ages", "forever", "timeless" or "for eternity". It is a Latin transliteration from the koine Greek word αἰών (ho aion), from the archaic αἰϝών (aiwon). In Homer it typically refers to life or lifespan. Its latest meaning is more or less similar to the Sanskrit word kalpa and Hebrew word olam. A cognate Latin word aevum or aeuum (cf. αἰϝών) for "age" is present in words such as longevity and mediaeval.[1]

The Bible translation is a treatment of the Hebrew word olam and the Greek word aion. These words have similar meaning, and Young's Literal Translation renders them and their derivatives as "age" or "age-during". Other English versions most often translate them to indicate eternity, being translated as eternal, everlasting, forever, etc. However, there are notable exceptions to this in all major translations, such as Matthew 28:20: "...I am with you always, to the end of the age" (NRSV), the word "age" being a translation of aion. Rendering aion to indicate eternality in this verse would result in the contradictory phrase "end of eternity", so the question arises whether it should ever be so.[3] Proponents of universal reconciliation point out that this has significant implications for the problem of hell.[4]


Contrast Matthew 25:46 in well-known English translations with its rendering in Young's Literal Translation:

And these shall go away to punishment age-during, but the righteous to life age-during. (YLT)[5]

Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life. (NIV)[6]

These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life. (NASB)[7]

And these shall go away into everlasting punishment, but the righteous into eternal life. (KJV)[8]

And these will depart into everlasting cutting-off, but the righteous ones into everlasting life. (NWT)[9]



Матей 25:46

Цитат
46 И тия ще отидат във вечно наказание, а праведните във вечен живот.
Цитат
46 И ще отидат те във вечна мъка; а праведните в живот вечен.



Christianity's idea of "eternal life" comes from the word for life, zoe, and a form of aeon,[10] which could mean life in the next aeon, the Kingdom of God, or Heaven, just as much as immortality, as in John 3:16.
« Последна редакция: Април 06, 2020, 10:32:52 am от Glasberg »

mind

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Относно световете в Библията ... зависи, на кой точно превод се позоваме.
Разбира се, имате известно право, това което цитирах не е много показателно.

Но ако се разходим из цялото Писание, ще се натъкнем на една по-различна картина.

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12 И сънува, и ето стълба изправена на земята, чийто връх стигаше до небето; и Божиите ангели се качваха и слизаха по нея.
13 И Господ стоеше над нея...

Цитат
7 И стана война на небесата: Излязоха Михаил и неговите ангели да воюват против змея; и змеят воюва заедно със своите ангели;
8 обаче, те не надвиха, нито се намери вече място за тях на небето.
9 И свален биде големият змей, оная старовременна змия която се нарича дявол и сатана, който мами цялата вселена; свален биде на земята, свалени бидоха и ангелите му заедно с него.

Очевидно става въпрос за един друг свят, където се намира Божия престол и където обитават други негови творения. От наша гледна точка, това е друг, различен или един втори свят, който не виждаме и до който нямаме достъп. От гледна точка на съществото "ангел", обитаващ цялата вселената, включително и Земята - за него се явява един свят.

Почти, както го определи Psyhea, само че без завесата, която служи да замаскира нашето невидение.

Може би,съществата "прехождат" от един паралел в друг ,сякаш преминават през завеса,но всъщност си обитават една и съща вселена или един и същи свят...

Така че за нас, като хора, е по-правилно светове.

Да поясня - за мен, вселена свят, няма нужда да си осакатяваме речника.

Дали има много светове в нашата вселена? - Вероятно.
Дали има други вселени, освен нашата? - Вероятно.


Такива и подобни допускания се прилагат в жанра на фантастичното творчество, но когато навлезат в сферата на науката и започнат да се изнасят лекции, презентации, да се излъчват научни кадри с образователен характер - те вече стават отровното семе, посявано в умовете на хората. Обикновено се започва с някакви факти и постепенно се отклонява до хипотезата, която искат да натъртят, да я вменят за истина. По този начин, плюс медийното разпространение се оформят цели легиони от последователи. Даже бих казал, цяла култура с нови религии. Да вярваш в недоказуемото е религия, но малцина си признават.

Според мен се случва това:

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Нека за гоите да играе най-главна роля онова, което ние сме им внушили да считат за повеление на науката, на “теорията”. За тази цел,
чрез нашата преса ние постоянно възбуждаме сляпо доверие към тези научни повеления. Интелигентните гои ще се кичат със знания и без да
проверяват логичността им, ще привеждат в действие всички получени от науката сведения, които нашите агенти така комбинират, че да
възпитат умовете им в нужната за нас насока.
   
 

vesso6

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   Линк с интересна информация, която дава отговори на някои въпроси по темата, на руски език е:https://science.ru-land.com/stati/kolskiy-poluostrov-ezomir

vesso6

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   За тези, които не разбират руски език направих частичен превод на статията.

λ

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Това е последното, което бих приел за "отговор на някой въпрос по темата". Типични диви измишльотини в руски стил - лаконично, неизчерпателно и категорично хвърляне на готови и противоречащи си заключения в лицето на читателя.

Никого не съветвам да се информира с подобни "източници". Проблемът може би идва от това, че на български няма книги за Шаубергер и информацията е кът.

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